This is a Western Hero salute to the brave Americans who tracked the stinking bastard back to his fetid lair and killed him like the dog that he was.
This does not mean we won the war on terror. It does tell the bad guys of the world that even if it takes years, we will track you down and kill you if you mess with us, and that is an extremely important message.
Will the West Get its Mojo Back?
Will this change anything? Will this invigorate a culture gone weak and morally flaccid?
Will Great Britain now stop paying millions to jihadi jailbirds and acting as a launching pad for thousands more?
Will the US continue to grant citizenship to immigrant criminals convicted of terror-related charges?
We have brave men and women doing grim work in dangerous places. May their efforts not be in vain.
57 comments:
Our armed forces do certainly deserve a salute, but...
C'mon, isn't this all just a bit too convenient?!!
Just as Obama is beginning to stump for re-election, he can suddenly produce a "real" birth certificate and take down Osama bin Laden in the same week? And no sooner than the news has been delivered, Osama’s body has been whisked off to a burial at sea?
Oh, doubly convenient.
If you’ve never seen “Wag The Dog” then you must drop everything and do so now!
Are you serious? I thought you bigger and brighter than this.
Obama messed-up again by bowing to the east by burying the jackal at sea within 24 hours, a ghost is born.
If we had him on ice for the world to see then there would be no questions and no islamic deniers.
There is not one real American that would recoil at seeing his head literally on a silver platter at least once but if accounts are true even that opportunity has been lost.
Personally, I think we should have hung his ass from a lamp post Mussolini style...
Divine. ???
I spent many years in the military, and I always separate the political from the strictly military. The troops who did this are heroes and are to be congratulated, regardless of the politics.
This was a brilliant military and intelligence operation. I can't wait to read the whole story.
Whatever one thinks of the politics, you can't take this victory away from our armed forces.
I understand your stance regarding the military although I shudder to think of all the men and women lost who actually thought they were fighting for freedom and not, in fact, the interest of the banks.
I do wonder why the body was hastily buried at sea. Don't you?
Osama Bin Laden was a spoiled rich kid trained by the CIA. One man. It is the unconstitutional policies that caused 9-11. No more no less.
Have you read Osama's Declaration of War dated 1996?
His alleged death will not bring back the dead, or the money, or the economy. It will not result in the phasing out of the TSA, nor will it bring our troops home.
This is the show, people! Get your popcorn!
It's about time!
We'd better be extra careful for a while - New Yorkers especially. We can expect retaliation.
JMJ
It just gives Hollywood material for "Obama" The Movie.
Divine,
It's not about bringing back the dead or making everything in the world right again. It's about justice. I'm no judge or executioner, and being a flawed human being I don't think I have the right to say who lives or who dies. Thanksfully, that decision is left up to others.
But justice must be done to everyone. He's paid for his crimes, and although that payment may not make up for all the damage he's caused, he has been given his due.
Again, we have yet to see the real impact this will have on the world, if any, but at the very least we can say that one psychopath has met his end.
And Silver, I'm sure you know that desecrating the body of the dead is, historically, one of the lowest forms of human behavior. I know that governments did it, but I like to think that Western Civilization has progressed beyond that point.
Putting his body on humiliating display would be no better than the soldier's bodies being dragged through Mogadishu.
Divine: To say we caused 9/11 is sick. That's the equivalent of saying a rape victim "deserved it" because of how she dressed or acted.
We went into Bosnia to save Muslims. We rescued Kuwait from the clutches of Iraq. We tried to feed starving Muslims in Africa...
Of course Osama would cite the JOOOOOOOS! and America...
I was in Afghanistan ready to go into Kashmir back in 2005 to deliver aid after the devastating earthquake. The Pakistani government quashed our efforts because they did not want Pakistanis to see US troops in a good light, as had recently happened in Indonesia.
It is a sick culture that would rather see its people die in misery than be helped by the infidel.
I understand the libertarian argument well, but you are drifting into self-loathing troofer territory, discounting anything good from the US and apologizing for a repugnant hateful, culture. I doubt that is your intent, but that is how you come off.
What we should learn is that no good deed goes unpunished, especially when performed for ungrateful people.
I think the lesson we should learn is to stop helping people who hate us.
Bullshit, Silver. Our interventionist policies are the precise reason people hate Americans. Deny this at your own peril.
You see, over a million dead civillians, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers, children...we have enemies.
It really isn't that difficult to understand if you wanted to.
Your boys fight and die for the banks.
You sure like to pick and choose your "facts".
So what caused the 1993 WTC bombing? What millions did we kill back then?
Your worldview is simplistic and naive and I'm surprised you've so willingly swallowed islamist propaganda.
We will always have enemies. It's human nature. Have you ever read any history? Has their ever been a golden era of peace?
I'm naive? Okay.
You're right, buddy. before 1993 the US nver killed an innocent.
I have a bridge to sell you.
You said "millions." So what were the millions of deaths that caused AQ to bomb the WTC in 1993?
Don't put words in my mouth. Millions of innocent people have been killed by US military. That is a fact.
I never mentioned the WTC. Why did you?
Don't tell me you really think they hate us because of our freedoms? Is that why Japan bombed Pearl Harbor...because they envied our freedom? Nothing to do with our interventionist polices, eh?
You can do better than this.
Divine,
Check your history. We helped Iran overthrow their Shah, and we helped Afghanistan repel the Russians.
As Silver said, we defended Kuwait against Saddam, we stomped Saddam and ended his reign of terror, we're still working on getting the Taliban out of Afghanistan.
We bombed Serbia during Clinton's administration, and now we're bombing Libya. All of this we've done to help Muslims. We were ASKED to help in Libya, and in Serbia we were upholding our human rights stance.
I'm not saying America is perfect, because we're not. I understand that the deaths of innocents at our hands, accidental or intentional, are lamentable. But don't buy into this crap that we actually are the great Satan. This world was broken long before America was even a thought, and broken it shall remain.
If you're always looking at the glass half empty, then you're going to miss the times when it's half full (and vice versa).
I read Bin Laden's declaration of War. It is very plainly written. I suggest you do the same.
Nonetheless, do you really think that any of this would have happened had the US kept to Washington's non-interventionist policies?
Divine: You are incoherent. Maybe you need to regroup and reform your argument.
I mention the 1993 WTC bombing in response to your comment...
Our interventionist policies are the precise reason people hate Americans. Deny this at your own peril.
You see, over a million dead civillians, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers, children...we have enemies.
So what exactly did we do to upset those who carried out that attempted bombing?
And I didn't say you were naive, I said your worldview was naive and simplistic.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Oh c'mon Silver. Divine is absolutely correct. There's no denying it. We were not attacked on 9/11 because "they hate our freedoms" or any insipid BS like that. We were attacked because we made ourselves a convenient unifying enemy by meddling in the ME for decades. We propped up crooked regimes. And then there's Israel...
If we were such virulent anti-Semitics just 60-odd short years ago, and if we truly lived up to our ideal as the great "exceptional" "city on a hill" that we pretend to be, we could have taken in the Jewish refugees after WWII, and today there'd be no Israel, and that whole phony excuse for the misery of the ME people could have been averted.
No one is "blaming" the US for 9/11, but we sure made ourselves a convenient target. The rape anaogy is wrong. A better analogy would be the guy walking through Harlem dressed as a Klansman with a placard reading "Kill all the n!@@#rs."
Don't be surprised when you get your ass kicked for that. It doesn't make it right - but if it surprises you, then you're a moron.
JMJ
Oops!
"If we weren't such virulent anti-Semitics just 60-odd short years ago..."
JMJ
In the words of Ramzi Yusef:
Yousef mailed letters to various New York newspapers just before the attack, in which he claimed he belonged to 'Liberation Army, Fifth Battalion'.[7] These letters made three demands: an end to all US aid to Israel, an end to US diplomatic relations with Israel, and a demand for a pledge by the United States to end interference "with any of the Middle East countries' interior affairs." He stated that the attack on the World Trade Center would be merely the first of such attacks if his demands were not met. In his letters Yousef admitted that the World Trade Center bombing was an act of terrorism, but that this justified because "the terrorism that Israel practices (which America supports) must be faced with a similar one."
Divine: I grant you this. If we cut off Israel and left them to be slaughtered and invaded by Muslims, then yes, the Muslims would probably consider us friends, or at least good little dhimmis.
I don't like foreign interventions, but Israel is a legal state per UN declaration.
If we're not standing in their path to murder and mayhem why attack us?
Instead, they would simply and slowly take over our culture, as they are doing in Europe. Speaking of which, why did they carry out terrorist bombings in pacifist Spain?
Things are not as simple as you wish them to be.
I never said they hate us "because of our freedoms," so take that stupid talking point off the table.
Thank you Jersey for getting to the bottom of it. You said what Divine was too afraid to:
If there were no Israel everything would be lollipops and roses.
Silver, what you fail to recognize is that the chicken did, indeed, come before the egg.
Goat herders join fundamentalist regimes AFTER we bomb their family into oblivion. The only way they feel they can exact their revenge is by joining the highly funded fundamentalists.
I guarantee Islam would not have as many followers if we stayed out of foreign affairs. WE are ascertaining the ranks will grow with our interventionism.
Again, Silver...do NOT put words in my mouth. Wrong again.
"Goat herders join fundamentalist regimes AFTER we bomb their family into oblivion."
A simple stereotype. Yes, this happens, but the reasons for jihad are multifarious, including high unemployment that prevents young college-educated men from being able to attract a bride and simply settle down to a normal life.
Goat herders didn't plan the 1993 bombing nor the 2001 attack: Educated urban men from Saudi Arabia and Egypt did.
"Thank you Jersey for getting to the bottom of it. You said what Divine was too afraid to:
If there were no Israel everything would be lollipops and roses."
WOOOOOOOO! Easy there. Let's not get all sleazy now. Let's argue like respectful adults, okay?
I NEVER said that and Divine and I NEVER meant that. There'd still be all that OIL - the NUMBER ONE reason we mess around over there. Israel is a rhetorical excuse for the monarchies, Juntas, Theocracies and Kleptocracies of the ME. They are certainly not the cause of their problems! Unfortunately, because we are so close to Israel, we get dragged into that rhetorical sleaziness.
JMJ
I never took you as a pawn for the banks, Silver...until now.
Jersey: You said it, but to your credit, you called it a phony issue:
"we could have taken in the Jewish refugees after WWII, and today there'd be no Israel, and that whole phony excuse for the misery of the ME people could have been averted."
The real issue is oil. Try running a global economy without it. I for one believe that if we get out of there, whoever takes over the oil will have to sell it on the global market, they can't eat it, but we're not at that point, we're where we are.
And there's still the matter of the State of Israel. Do we cut them off? Seriously?
Divine: You need to elaborate beyond the "pawn of the banks" bumper sticker.
Your call of antisemitism is no less pathetic than the Left's call of racism when one disagrees.
...and I do disagee.
You will not change my stance, nor I yours.
I am going to garden
Have a nice day!
Andie
Silver,
You're missing the point.
Of course we have to continue to support Israel. It was too late to do anything else 53 years ago! We can't change that now. It's not like the Israelis are all going to pack up and move to Arizona tomorrow. We owe them. We have to support them.
Look, the point is simple: We made ourselves a convenient target for the ME terrorists. It was avoidable, but it's too late now to change that reality. The lesson here is clear: In the future, let's not mess around in other people's affairs unless they do truly need our help, as the Jewish refugees did after WWII, and we truly want to help them, not to take advantage of their plight for war profiteering.
JMJ
I accused no one of racism or anti-Semitism.
It took us awhile to cut through Divine's incoherence, but it boils down to oil and Israel.
How do we deal with each issue viz the inhabitants of the Middle East?
@ Jersey:
"The lesson here is clear: In the future, let's not mess around in other people's affairs unless they do truly need our help..."
Amen to that, Jersey. And I was not accusing you or Andi of anti-Semitism. This is a difficult issue, and I do not believe in screaming at anyone who questions the actions of Israel.
I do push back when people, like Andi, come here spouting Islamist talking points. She's too smart for that.
Meanwhile China is making deals with all the oil rich countries for future use. So while Obama is making us weaker China will not only be the richest economy but also have the most powerful military powered by oil. I think it is in out best interest to also secure oil for our future otherwise our future will be glib and if we ever have war with China they will not be as concerned about innocent civilians.
China may need us now to purchae their goods but for how long?
I hear ya' Silver. I think you should cut Divine some slack on this one, though.
Lisa,
What the heck do you mean Obama "made us weaker?" What are you talking about? How are we "Weaker"?
JMJ
Victory and congratulations to the great and courageous efforts of the Navy Seals!!
Hooyah!! I hope I got that right.
Not to interrupt your never-ending squabbles with your liberal buddies, Silver, but when you say we tracked OBL to his 'fetid lair,' I would like to point out that this fetid lair you mention is not simply the million dollar chalet in Abbottabad, but the whole festering pus pot that is Pakistan.
The Pakistani government, to include our 'pal' Pervez Musharref, harbored this maggot, fed him, treated him like a king, heated and cooled his chalet, and secured it like Fort Knox for six long years. Six, count 'em, and denied that he was there the whole time.
Jersey: I am not mad at divine; I am probing her argument. She came here with pat talking points, but the world just ain't that simple.
I've stated various times that we need to get the hell out of that part of the world. I've also stated many times that we need to learn the lesson you just stated: Stop helping people who hate us.
This post today is not about theory or what-ifs or bankers I'm supposedly a pawn to, it is about a real-life situation that just happened.
It's easy to sit in the comfort of the USA and pontificate, but I've been there and seen the stuff I write about first hand.
I am happy as hell that we whacked UBL and I am ecstatic that we took no casualties doing it. Score one for the US of A.
Excellent observations, Fredd.
All the more reason to cut sling on these duplicitous bastards. I'm tired of funding them.
And for the record, Divine is a good person and she's definitely not a liberal.
Perhaps I could have made myself more clear but I have the flu and limited patience for writing...even on a good day.
Our Navy Seals did what had to be done, akin to putting down a rabid dog. I, frankly, do not "get" the rejoicing thing.
I never denied the existence of religious fanatics, nor do I underestimate the hatred they have for the Infidel. That being said, I stand by my assertion that American interventionism plays a big role in the ongoing hatred of our country.
The "pawn" comment was intended to reflect the fact that our brave soldiers are fighting and dying for a cause they don't understand. It is not American freedom, now is it?
I have tremendous respect for you and I do not wish to offend but I will always through my opinion in, even if you disagree.
Andie
...And you're always welcome to voice your opinion here, Divine.
Every action has consequences and reactions, and the US action on the world stage are certainly not exempt.
In this world pristine good is rarely found. Fossil fuels are cheap and abundant, but they cause pollution. Everything has a cost.
Is it better to help out a certain country or people? It is rarely a clear-cut issue. There are pros and cons to everything.
And our all-volunteer military does know what it is fighting for: To kill bad guys.
We should take heart that nation building and foreign interventions are becoming unpopular, even on the right. After all, as I wrote in a blog post awhile back, such activities are very unconservative.
Perhaps we will learn some good lessons, if only for a generation...
Let's hope it lasts more than a year, let alone a generation.
After all, it was George W. Bush himself who lambasted "nation-building" when he first ran for President - and most "conservatives" stood right there with him when he radically diverged from the position.
It is so apropos that we all had this really excellent discourse today. I can't believe I actually completely agree with Divine! "Only in America!" As Don King always says! Tonight, we can rejoice.
JMJ
"Millions of innocent people have been killed by US military"
And 10's of millions have been liberated by our military.
But the US is always the bad guys.
It's getting old!
Hope the celebrations are still going on over there, one thing i wanted to note, for all the bluster from the muslim world about injustice, superiority, bravery and their willingness to die, it was supposedly inferior infidel Americans who reached into their heartland and killed one of their heroes who was really just a sniveling coward hiding behind his wife till the very end. I'm sure the gutless rat would have grabbed a small girl if there was one nearby. I spit on his cowardice and throw my old shoes at his carcass.
I'm just ecstatic that this scumbag was brought to justice. That such an audacious operation was conducted successfully is testament to the lethality of your armed forces. American warriors shot this cowardly vermin and once again did the world another favor. Thank you America.
"Will the West Get its Mojo Back?"
If enough of us cannot bring ourselves to celebrate the killing of this piece of shit, then we have lost our mojo. The reason being that if we cannot celebrate what this really is - audacity, heroism, skill, unmatched lethality and a culture that produced all this and which is unique to the west - and instead think it was just blind luck, then it means we have lost the will to win this war.
"Will Great Britain now stop paying millions to jihadi jailbirds and acting as a launching pad for thousands more?"
No way, they're far too gone for that sort of common sense. The only way they'll stop funding their own slide to obscurity is when they have no more money left.
Regarding all the discussions about intervening or not intervening and the various theories about how wonderful life would be if America stayed out of everyone's way. Let me assure you, if you relinquish your spot as top dog, some one else will take it and eventually they'll come after you or your children in some form or other and you'll have to bow down and do as they tell you. Or you fight.
As an example from down under, some of our business folk have been arrested and imprisoned on trumped-up charges over in China in recent times. Our PM went over there recently and brought up the subject along with human rights with their leaders and we essentially got the diplomatic equivalent of - @#$% off - so guess what we had to do.
So you see, there's always a price to pay, and pay it we all will.
What the heck do you mean Obama "made us weaker?" What are you talking about? How are we "Weaker"?
Jersey if we are economically weaker ,which is the goal , then we are just plain old weaker.
All this spending and borrowing makes us weak. Does it make you weaker if you rack up thousands on you persoanl credit card?
Oh, for Christ's sake Lisa. Get off it. That's just stupid. That's not anyone's "goal." Besides, the causes of our current economic woes ALL pre-date the Obama presidency.
There's nothing about what you said that makes any sense at all.
JMJ
I'm not too keen on the giddy celebration that some are letting loose over this. Should he have been eliminated? You bet. Am I relieved that Osama is gone. Sure. But deliriously, dancing in the streets, happy? No, that's kinda morbid.
But on a related tangent, I find it quite odd (make that, apathetically hypocritical) that we don't exhibit the same wild-eyed zeal for exacting similar swift and finite justice upon scumbag murderers who lounge in relative comfort in our own prisons. It should be much easier for the SEAL teams to do what's desperately needed with these dregs of society - after all, we know precisely which cell these wastes of skin live in. Ok, maybe it ain't exactly apples to apples, but...
And I wonder how many Americans fiercely oppose the death penalty for domestic crimes that our own citizens commit yet at the same time joyfully celebrate the (very expensive) killing of foreign criminals.
Rob, if you believe American prisons provide anything close to "relative" comfort to the vast majority of prisoners, you don't know anything whatsever about the American prison system.
We have among the worlds worst prison systems. They are hells on Earth. We should be deeply, deeply ashamed of ourselves for that. I would much, much rather die than spend my life in an American prison - unless, of course, it's one of the posh prison farms where they put all those heros of you righties when they finally get caught.
JMJ
The answer to your questions:
Will the West Get its Mojo Back? - NO
Will this change anything? Will this invigorate a culture gone weak and morally flaccid? - NO
Will Great Britain now stop paying millions to jihadi jailbirds and acting as a launching pad for thousands more? - NO
Will the US continue to grant citizenship to immigrant criminals convicted of terror-related charges?
- YES
As long as Obama and his ilk remain in office.
Okay Rev, what would the next bunch look like? How different do you think a GOP administration would make things?
Be realistic for a change.
JMJ
Yeah the timing was kind of convenient. But the sea burial eliminates a holy martyr site.
Jersey, compared to the often-grissly fate of their poor victims, the prison cells that murderers spend their days in are far beyond "comfy."
So I say, let's turn the focus inward now and clean up some of our own mess, starting with a death row purge.
Jersey, if our prisons are so deplorable, why aren't they more of a deterrent? And really, given that scumbag rappers can easily smuggle MP3 players and cellphones into prison, how bad can they really be?
"Jersey, if our prisons are so deplorable, why aren't they more of a deterrent?"
Many a Third World country asks itself the same thing, Rob.
Americans are apparently not the most realistic people in the world.
If you'd be happy to get your anus raped everyday because you're selling some DVD's for smack money for your rapist, then good for you. I'd rather die.
OUR PRISON SYSTEM IS A DISGUSTING SHAME AND EVERYONE WHO SUPPORTS IT IS A SCUMBAG.
JMJ
Jersey: I have seen US prisons in documentaries, and I have seen third-world prisons in real-life.
You obviously have not. There is no comparison.
Excellent article from "The Opinion Maker"...
http://www.opinion-maker.org/2011/05/obls-demise-some-consequences/
Divine: Interesting opinion
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